Which university is better for actuary?

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Which university is better for actuary? - Shuja - 05-28-2005

Hey u guys, how y'all doin?

I've been having this problem for the past few days, I got an offer to study Actuarial Science at the University of Toronto, the University of Waterloo and the University of Warwick (UK) but I can't decide which one will be more beneficial for my future?

Thanks once again and I hope to hear from u all!

regards,

Shuja.

- derivativetrader - 05-30-2005

<blockquote id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Shuja
 Hey u guys, how y'all doin?

I've been having this problem for the past few days, I got an offer to study Actuarial Science at the University of Toronto, the University of Waterloo and the University of Warwick (UK) but I can't decide which one will be more beneficial for my future?

Thanks once again and I hope to hear from u all!

regards,

Shuja.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Hey Shuja,

I guess it's quite close call between the universities that you have mentioned. Although, I don't have any personal experience of any of the listed degrees but the geenral perception that I have about the universities and graduate market is that you should go for university's ranking rather than the department or the programme's itself.

I've limited knowledge about Canadian programmes but I know for the fact that Warwick is a good school and is seen as a target by major actuarial and non-actuarial finance employers. I don't know what would be the case for your other choices.

I guess the course you are referring at Warwick is MMORSE?

DT

- Shuja - 05-31-2005

Hey DT,

yeah i applied to MMORSE and i've chosen the fourth year specialisation in actuarial and financial mathematics, the thing is that University of toronto is ranked higher on an international level, but the university of warwick has a much bigger mathematics building (they spent like 15 million pounds on the new building!) and its ranked really high in the UK.

Its a really tough choice since university of toronto just increased it fees by a whole load so both unis are equally as expensive, but i've heard rumors that the UK job market is a lot bigger than the canadian job market so i guess that warwick has a higher standing in that prospect.

Anyways thanks for everything man really appreciate it.

regards,

Shuja.

- derivativetrader - 05-31-2005

<blockquote id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Shuja
 Hey DT,

yeah i applied to MMORSE and i've chosen the fourth year specialisation in actuarial and financial mathematics, the thing is that University of toronto is ranked higher on an international level, but the university of warwick has a much bigger mathematics building (they spent like 15 million pounds on the new building!) and its ranked really high in the UK.

Its a really tough choice since university of toronto just increased it fees by a whole load so both unis are equally as expensive, but i've heard rumors that the UK job market is a lot bigger than the canadian job market so i guess that warwick has a higher standing in that prospect.

Anyways thanks for everything man really appreciate it.

regards,

Shuja.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Based on the facts that you have mentioned in your last post, I would personally go for Warwick - but then again that could be biased since as I already said I don't have any info. on Canadian progarmmes.

Feel free to contact me off-forum should you need more info. or general guidance. (I study at the LSE and am about to go into my final year in their bachelors in actuarial science programme)

DT

- Shuja - 06-04-2005

Hey DT,

hows it goin? wow ur at LSE that amazing! i got a conditional offer from them for a slightly easier program BMS (business mathematics and statistics) but living in london might be a bit too difficult for me.

DT, i had a question about summer vacation work, do students from places like warwick get internships or vacation work easily in places like banks or other financial institutions? cuz i was thinking that it was would be really cool to work during the summer rather than just laze about.

anywyas thanks again for everything,

regards,

Shuja.

- derivativetrader - 06-04-2005

<blockquote id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Shuja
 Hey DT,

hows it goin? wow ur at LSE that amazing! i got a conditional offer from them for a slightly easier program BMS (business mathematics and statistics) but living in london might be a bit too difficult for me.

DT, i had a question about summer vacation work, do students from places like warwick get internships or vacation work easily in places like banks or other financial institutions? cuz i was thinking that it was would be really cool to work during the summer rather than just laze about.

anywyas thanks again for everything,

regards,

Shuja.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

I've been at the school for two years and enjoyed to the max. I had my last exam of second year today and feeling really good, not because I have done some remarkable stuff but that 2 years are gone!

Jokes aside, I think if you want flexibility, i.e. actuarial or banking or any thing related, then I would strongly recommend taking on BMS at LSE. It is very easy to switch to AS after first year and many people do that every year. My best friend in fact did this and it wasn't really a problem. If I were you I would forget going to Warwick or any other school in UK (including Cass) and would come to LSE.

Landing an internship isn't easy these days especially at permier organisations. On its own university, degree, results etc. wouldn't count for anything. You need to do alot of extra curricular stuffs to get anything near to i-banking stuff and to some extend to top actuarial firms.

I managed to do internships in all my summers so far but I know that for fact that it wasn't easy getting in. I had to do all sort of things.

Post specific questions you may have on BMS, LSE or anything relating to career stuff.

DT

- eShA - 06-05-2005

best of luck for results....

regard,,,,
from the best
and top of all
eShA

Although this may seem a paradox, all exact science is dominated
by the idea of approximation.

- Sohail Arif - 06-06-2005

DT i think u r wrong about lse being better than cass for Actuarial it is a widely known fact cass of city uni of london and wharton of U Penn are the two best places on the face of this earth for actuarial sci. cass has the largest faculty in risk managment actuarial sci and insurance in entire europe. not to mention the highest no of Fellows of IOA in it faculty. the highest employability rates the best relations with the industy and the IOA the oldest dept for actuarial sci in the country (30 years) if u just look at the modules and their syllabus, cass gives to its students u would simply realise that lse is about a decade behind to come up with the faculty and dept capable of providing students with such modules. Inside Careers one of the biggest Actuarial recruiters doesnt even aknowledge lse as a course provider for Actuarial Science, but tell u what it does recognize cass and it even recognizes heriot watt and kent. if it was anyother subject that u would have claimed lse to be better at that cetainly would have been true but when it comes down to actuarial the only place i think better than Cass is U penn's wharton.

- derivativetrader - 06-06-2005

Sohail Bhai, chill yaar. Neither me nor you going to get any credits on which university is better. I understand your point of view and acknolwedge the fact that LSE is a newer programme (only about 10-12 years old) and hence it hasn't yet reached the expertise of City's in actuarial science programme. Also, City has more than one actuarial science programme whereas LSE only has one undergraduate level course. I think City also has a PhD programme in Act. Sc. which further shows its quality and depth of expertise in the subject.

But, if you read my post again you would understand that I was not comparing Cass with LSE on Actuarial Science programme. I was making a point on someone who's yet to decide whether actuarial science or the actuarial profession in right for him or not and if someone is in doubt then its always better to keep your option open. I think without doing into any useless debate we should acknolwedge that LSE, overall, is better placed than the other universities that I mentioned and hence I advised Shuja.

I'm just curious how big is your class size this year and are you on 3yr or 4 yr course? What is your plan for summer?

DT

- derivativetrader - 06-06-2005

<blockquote id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Inside Careers one of the biggest Actuarial recruiters doesnt even aknowledge lse as a course provider for Actuarial Science, but tell u what it does recognize cass and it even recognizes heriot watt and kent.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Yaar, Inside Careers is just a career services firm and doesn't hire actuaries explicitly and hence they are not 'biggest' actuarial recruiters. The fact that they didn't list lse as one of the programme provider could be any reason - one of them possibly may be that LSE didn't fell into their criteria, i.e. long and established programmes.

But then again, not many freshers into the undergraduate programmes knows what they are actuallly getting into. The actual actuarial stuff doesn't start till second or third year and therefore it may not be good idea to close most of your options and that is one of the reason why most people who are in this profession tends to do maths or other 'open' subjects at university.

DT

- BeAtNiK - 06-06-2005

I think derivativetrader has got a point, but dont u think warwick is better recognized for Maths in UK than LSE? I mean lse would have been a way better option if the course would have been economics or law etc, but for maths related course warwick might be better. I think shuja would be fine if he goes to either univ since both are targeted by employers. I havnt got a great insight into the actuarial profession as DT and i dont know which would be better if he is sure he wants to be an Actuary, but correct me if im wrong.

- derivativetrader - 06-07-2005

<blockquote id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by BeAtNiK
 I think derivativetrader has got a point, but dont u think warwick is better recognized for Maths in UK than LSE? I mean lse would have been a way better option if the course would have been economics or law etc, but for maths related course warwick might be better. I think shuja would be fine if he goes to either univ since both are targeted by employers. I havnt got a great insight into the actuarial profession as DT and i dont know which would be better if he is sure he wants to be an Actuary, but correct me if im wrong.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

In the UK, it doesn't really much pay off if your university is top in your programme but the thing that really stands out is the overall ranking of your institution. So, although LSE is a business school (and hence it doesn't have good maths research opportunities than some of the other physical sciences schools) it has overall good reputation and you ought to find its graduates in all leading organisations in different industries.

Let me give you a real life example. Most people would assume that because LSE's flagship course is economics so it must be top in country or region. The reality is it isn't. Another good fact is that graduates of the school who beats LSE don't get hired by many investment banks, whereas, LSE's economics and other graduates are normal to be hired by i-banks and other related finance employers.
The point is one should go for university's ranking rather than programmes reputation.

DT

- Shuja - 06-10-2005

Hey guys,

DT is right in saying that no matter wat degree course u've done an LSE graduate will always get a really well paid job (probably better than a warwick graduate). The main reasons i chose warwick over LSE is firstly cuz i wanted to study a lot more maths than actuary for my undergraduate degree and MMORSE seems to be the perfect course for that, secondly (and this is purely my opinion) i prefer to go to a campus university for my undergradute degree cuz in LSE the dorms are all over london and the sporting facilities and societies are mainly outside london, whereas in warwick everything is quite close together, and plus london can be quite hectic to live in and even dangerous for guys like me (i've never lived in a big metropolitan city before) and lastly going to LSE is quite expensive, those where kinda the reason i also declined imperial's offer for 'Mathematics with statistics for finance'.

Anyways, thanks for all the advise!

regards,

Shuja

- derivativetrader - 06-10-2005

<blockquote id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Shuja
 Hey guys,

DT is right in saying that no matter wat degree course u've done an LSE graduate will always get a really well paid job (probably better than a warwick graduate). The main reasons i chose warwick over LSE is firstly cuz i wanted to study a lot more maths than actuary for my undergraduate degree and MMORSE seems to be the perfect course for that, secondly (and this is purely my opinion) i prefer to go to a campus university for my undergradute degree cuz in LSE the dorms are all over london and the sporting facilities and societies are mainly outside london, whereas in warwick everything is quite close together, and plus london can be quite hectic to live in and even dangerous for guys like me (i've never lived in a big metropolitan city before) and lastly going to LSE is quite expensive, those where kinda the reason i also declined imperial's offer for 'Mathematics with statistics for finance'.

Anyways, thanks for all the advise!

regards,

Shuja

<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Good luck buddy and get in touch when you get to the England.

DT

- Syed - 07-24-2005

Actuary is one of the few professions where pedigree of your alma mater is never a filtering factor. I know thats a hard one to swallow, but ask someone involved in hiring ppl in the US, I'm sure you'll be pleasantly surprised.