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+--- Thread: Zaid Hamid Escaping (/showthread.php?tid=7526)
- awaisaftab - 04-01-2010
Dear Toronto Boy I will talk with you on Saturday or Monday.
Filhal baqi questions ko choro see the following links and just give answer of Q-6
http//www.youtube.com/watch?v=MjcCn6kIAF0&playnext_from=TL&videos=Y9nXB6btsCI&feature=sub
http//www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ONXg1_AZ7s&feature=related
http//www.tanzeem.org/announcements/zaid%20hamid2.pdf
Kia 3 Aalim jin main se Dr. Israr ko mere khayal main sabhi mante hain jhoot bol rahe hain ????? Kia Akela Zaid Hamid Sacha ha.
- kamranACA - 04-02-2010
Lo jee dobara aa gaey phir say. So, he confirmed abhi tabiat ke saffaai aur honi baaqi hai. Abhi aafaaqa nahi hua!!
Barkhurdar,
Apni umar kay 32 saal ka aik dam say dukh hona shuroo ho gaya and you felt a bit disgrace when your failure personality is discussed but you feel no botheration in keeping on posting bakwaas stuff about others including Zaid Hamid. Kuch sharam karo. Apni baat say khud he koi sabaq seekh lo.
Meray baarey main jo bhi likho uski logic bhi samajh main aati hai. Kisi teray jaisay bey-aqal maulvi ko koi "GHATYA" ya "Do Takkay ka"¨ likh kar uski tail par paaon rakh day tu who aur karey ga kiya. "Hushhhhhhhh" tu keh he diya hua hai tumko. Ab yeh sab tu karo gey hee.
Jo contradiction tum nay dhoondh rakhi hain un par sab tum par hanstay hain. Aik aqal ka andha Zaid Hamid ko kaafir qaraar denay par tula betha hai, aur munaafiq itnaa hai keh jab bhi pooch kehta hai ¡§mainay kab usko Kaafir qaraar diya¡¨. Betaa apni contradiction theek kar sab say pehlay. Jin ko tum contradiction kehtay ho who tumko contradiction iss liyey lagti hai kyun keh tumhara DABBA (ooper waali manzzal) khaali hai yaa kuch aur bhara hua hai uss main.
Agar apni zaat par taras hai tu aqal say socho kia bakwas kartay ho. Aik bhi baat ke tumko samajh nahi, Arbi kay chandd lafaz RATT liyay hain, kuch self-made designations yaad kar liyey hain aur chalay ho roab jhaarnay apni naatawaan jahaalat ka. BTW tum par koi bhi hansay tumko kia faraq parta hai. Tum par tu loge pehlay bhi hanstay thay; we have all the threads alive where your DURGAT has been made time and again by invariably all members. Who sab ghalat thay aur aik tum theek ho Mashallah.
Imam Khumeni sahib ke baat baar baar karo gey bhi tu apni he zaat ko gandaa karo gey. Kuch cheezain aisee hoti hain jo nafrat bharhaati hain. Tum ko aqal ho iss baat ke tu sharm say doob martay because you are already well known for your hate creating yelling aur ruknaa mushkil hai tumhaaray liyey. Mujhay koi aur bhi poochhay gat u main mazeed detail main bata doon ga keh mujh ko PERSONALLY Khumeni sahib say kia kia ikhtelaaf hai. Ikhtelaaf rakhnaa jaaiz hai aur iss main koi gunah nahi. Tum kiya talaash karnaa chaahtay ho iss baat main?? Mujhay tumhaaray saath aur kai aur "ulema" kay saath ......(jo Arbi kay designation ratty hain tum nay).... bhi ikhtelaaf ho saktaa hai. Tum ya who Naoozbillah Farishtay hain ya Prophets hain (Naoozbillah) jo unsay ikhtelaaf nahi ho saktaa??
Aaj tak yeh tu bata nahi sakay "Ulema" kahaan say derive kia hua lafz hai aur baseless discussion kiyey jaa rahay ho. Kia iss kay baarey main search engine say kuch nahi milaa?? Ab ikhtelaaf tu aik doosray say sab ko hai aur ho sakta hai. Iss baat par tum jaisaa ghatya insaan kisi kay eemaan ka fatwa dey gaa kia? Kahaan likhaa hua hai keh kisi "maulvi", "aalim" ya "Ulema" say ikhtelaaf nahi ho saktaa??? Bataao gey zara??? Kyun Khuda banaaey jaa rahey ho chand Maulviyon ko (Naoozbillah).? Abb asaan feham baat par bakwaas jaari rakho gey tu kia ho ga? Damaagh hai ya bhuss bhari hui hai???? Abhi bhi kehtay hai "main nonhaa qaaqaa hoon kisi ko uksaa nahi raha kisi kay khilaaf". Teray jaisee cheez 100 saal bhi pipe main daal do waisee hee rehti hai. Tum ghatya logon kaa tu kaam he yahi hai, chand ratti rattaai baatein dhoondho, logon ko provoke karo aur aag laga do moaashray main aur aman tabaah kar do. Kai loge tumhain sharam dilaa chukay hain par tumko hoti tu aati na.
As far as your non-sense about my words that Khumeni Sahib was not a maulvi is concerned, even by putting in all your efforts you could not hide your immense JAHAALAT. Aur kehtay ho maina yeh saabit kar diyaa mainay who saabit kar diyaa. Betaa tum nay sirf yeh saabit kiyaa hai aaj tak keh tum bay panaah jaahil aur fasaadi tabiat kay maalik ho. Tumhara koi bhi thread uthaa lo, pehlay say aaaj tak, 99% cases main yahi kuch dekhnay ko milay gaa. Oh jaahil aadmi, I said "Khumeni sahib koi maulvi nahi thay; rather he was a great scholar, thinker, social reformer and philospher". Tumhara damaagh agar "scholar" ka matlab nahi samjhtaa to "Ayetullah" ka kahaan say samjhay ga?? Kyun bila-waja ka zore lagaa rahay ho aisee baat par jo tumhaari aqal say bari hai??? Search engines ka stuff tumko aqal nahi dey saktaa; main he nahi aur loge bhi samjha chukay hain tumko. Jhatt say gaey Khumeni Sahib ke talaash main aur baat banaanay ke nakaam koshish kar lee. Yeh saabit kia hai tum nay??? Yahi kuch apnay CMA main bhi saabit kartay ho issi liyay baray laaiq maanay jaatey ho.
Tumhaari expected bak bak (about Ahl-e-Tashi) ka zikar iss liyey kia keh tum say kuch bhi bay aqal harkat expect ke jaa sakti hai. Gham na kar zindagee pari hai abhi. I will tell you whenever you will yell about them on this forum. Time mil gaya tu zara teri puraani harkaton par bhi nazar daura kay dekhoon gaa. Kyun? Because you are a fool who can say anything about any one. Kabhi aalimon ke aulaad ban jaatey ho, kabhi pothohaari khoon daurnay lagta hai tumhaarey ander, kabhi buhat suljha huaa act karnay kee nakaam koshish, kabhi buhat bara economist ban jaaney ka drama aur kabhi manager accounts (jisko yeh nahi pata keh uski company ko kaunsay standards apply hotay hain). Kia ho tum?? Kuch bhi kar saktay ho. Damaagh naa ho tu jo marzi karo.
Madrissay ka syllabus! Kia baaat hai. Bhaai jin madrisson say teray jaisay nikaltay hain unki end product tu nazzar aa rahi hai, ab syllabus ko dekh kay kia kuch nai baat saamnay aa jaaey gee?? And yes, while saying something about ¡§Parrots¡¨ I am neither referring the real noble men of Allah nor a few quality educational institutions. Ab Allah ka nizaam tu chal raha hai naa aur Inshallah chaltay rehna hai. Har koi teray jaisa Jaahil tu nahi. Na he saarey madrissay teray jaisay ¡§parrots¡¨ produce kartay hain. Yahaan baat teri category ke ho rahi hai; don¡¦t mix it up. Agar yeh sirf teri category ka maumla na hota tu main Sarfarz Naeemee sahib ko refer na karta. Kuch tu aqal kar yaa "bay-aqal" honay kaa certificate lay rakha hai?
Takhasus-Fil-Hadees, Mashallah kia baat ke hai bhaai sahib nay. Tum ko pata hai? Chalo maan letay hain. Tum (aur tum jaison) nay kiyaa ukhaar liyaa hai aaj tak pata honay kay baa-wajood??? Agar samjho tu yahi aik sawaal hai. Aik Islmic country main dunyaa kee har buraai peak par maujood hai; aur tum bethay raho issi khushi main keh tumko Takhasus-Fil-Hadees ka pata hai. Kia approach hai. Mujhay Quran say zara yeh Lafaz nikaal kay parhaao please, meharbaani ho gee? Agar Sahi Hadees books say parha do tub hi shukriya. ) Koi naik kaam bhi kia karo. Sirf doodh ka dabba sarak par ragarnay ke awaaz he nikaaltay rehtay ho (a compliment given by "Spectrum" to you).
Aik aur baat, logon ko tu buhat kuch kehtay phir rahay ho; khud ke khabar bhi hai kuch? Tum ko kaun see authority hai mazhabi muamlaat par logon ko defame karnay ke??? Kaun say MUFTI ya Sheikh-ul-Hadees ho tum??? Pidar-e-man sultaan bood kay chakar main fatway diyey jaa rahay ho kiaa??? Abhi end par pohancho tumhaari auqaat wohaan mazeed waazeh ho jaaey gee keh tum ho kiaa.
Hamara dukh yeh hai keh aksar auqaat jo banda kisi aur field main nahi chaltaa who mazhab par qismat aazmaai shuroo kar detaa hai, aur phir sab ka ¡§Ulema¡¨ ban beth-taa hai apnay aap hee. Sab dost ird gird nazar daal kay dekh lein, khud he pata chalay gaa keh Parrots kaisay produce hotay hain. Buhat kam loge hotay hain (I know aisay loge bhi hain; and I have good luck of being in their company) jo qualitative educational back ground rakhtay hain aur religious studies ko adapt kartay hain. Otherwise, aksariyat who hai jo kisi aur field main nahi chal sakti, har taraf say nakaam hoti hai and at the end choose religion to make it their Takhta-e-Mashq (Naoozbillah). Yeh banda iss cheez kee aik misaal hai. Abb iss say aap kia expect kar saktay hain? Yahi joy eh kar raha hai.
Your following lines are showing what you are? Koi bhi parh lay sirf yeh he kaafi hain tumhaaray munh par bey-aqali aur takabbar ke mohar lagaanay kay liye. You said
...............I know k kuch Moderate and progressive /secular log bhee apne bachon ko hifz kerwatain take un k NATWAN kandhon pe bhet k Janat main ja sakain..............
Abb iss say zyada tumhaari zehniyat kahaan clear ho gee? Shukar hai kuch logon ko itnaa tu darr hai keh jannat main jaanaa asaan nahi. Tum jaisay aqal kay andhay nay kiyaa jannat ka ticket katwaya hua hai???????????? Hamein bhi dekhaao zara, ham bhi deedar kar lain uss ticket ka. Kis aalim kee aulaad ho jis nay tumko itni aqal bhi nahi dee????? Kyun unki matti paleed kar rahay ho. Iss say zyada zaleel harkat tum kiaa kar saktay ho? Allah kay Nabi PBUH nai aik sawal kay jawaab main khud apnay baaray main arshaad farmaya keh who apni naikiyon ke wajah say nahi, Allah ke rehmat say Jannat main jaaein gey (Mafhoom of a Hadees). Yeh Hadees ham jaison ko samjhaanay kay liyey he farmaai gai thee. Aur hamara aik Ghatya "Parrot" samjhta hai uss nay ticket ya license liya hua hai jannat ka. Kia ajeeb-ul-khalqat cheez hai yaar yeh bhi. Mainay bila-waja issko bay sharam nahi kaha. Yeh khud saabit kartaa hai har baat. Khuda ka khauf kar aur apni bakwaas par Tauba kar. Kyun apna emaan tabaah kar rahay ho sirf apnay jhoot ko paani denay kay liyey?
You know tumhaari issi aik baat par tumhaarey eeman kay baarey main tumhaarey he jaisay "Ulema" say "Fatwa" haasil kia jaa saktaa hai. Tum bihtar jaantay ho Fatwa tu mil he jaaey gaa. Aur who Fatwa agar main laaa kar yahaan copy kar doon tu kiaa haalat ho gee tumhaari. Doob kay mar jaao gey agar zara bhi sharam hui tu. Kyun keh Fatwa ka charhchaa tu khud kar he chukay ho. Mukar tu saktay nahi ho. But I know tumko sharam hai he nahi.
Tum nay sahi kaha jab tak insane khaamosh rahey uski jahaalat chhupi rehti hai. Tumhaari above harkat nay tumhaari jahaalat sab par khol khol kay bayaan kar dee hai. Zara bhi sharam hai tu Kuffaraa adaa karo iss Takkabar ka aur Fazool tareen baat ka aur Allah say muaafi mango. Tumhaarey haq main ab yahi bihtar hai.
BTW mujhay pata hai tumko sharam tu nahi aani.
Regards to all readers,
- Toronto_Boy - 04-02-2010
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, san" id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by awaisaftab</i>
<br />Dear Toronto Boy I will talk with you on Saturday or Monday.
Filhal baqi questions ko choro see the following links and just give answer of Q-6
http//www.youtube.com/watch?v=MjcCn6kIAF0&playnext_from=TL&videos=Y9nXB6btsCI&feature=sub
http//www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ONXg1_AZ7s&feature=related
http//www.tanzeem.org/announcements/zaid%20hamid2.pdf
Kia 3 Aalim jin main se Dr. Israr ko mere khayal main sabhi mante hain jhoot bol rahe hain ????? Kia Akela Zaid Hamid Sacha ha.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></font id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Awais Sahib
Mayri post ka maqsaad app say bahas karna nahi hay, aur nahi lambi lambi post karkay apna ya readers ka waqt zaya karna hay.
Haan iss tamam soorat-e-haal main jo mayri samjh main aya wo main nay pahlay bhi byan kia tha aur mazeed byan kardia hay. In essence, mayray khayal main iss tamam maslay ki haysiat storm in a cup of tea say zyada nahi hay. Agarcha dosray muslims par iss tarha ki onglian othanay kay buhat bhayanak natayaj nikaltay hain. Yahi baat main samjhanay ki koshish karraha hon. Iss tamam exercise say sirf intishaar payda hosakta hay jo pahlay hi buhat zyada hay aur mazeed barh raha hay. Iss baat ka andaza iss baat say bhi lagaya jasakta hay kay sirf chand dino kay under iss muaamlay ki aaar main (mayray khyal main) kisi teesray fareeq (3rd party) nay aik jayad aalim ko Qatal kar dya hay aur oska ilzam aik doosray muslim (Zaid Hamid) par jaaraha hay. Nateeja kia hay, Pakistan aur muslims kay dusman apni apni dushmania iss maslay kay pichay nikaal rahay hain.
Agar iss baat ko mazeed aagay barhaya gya to aagay bhi yahi nataij niklain ga.
Mayray khyal main mayra point of view readers par kafi clear ho chuka hay. Agar main nay mazeed zaroorat samjhi, interest aur time hoa to mazeed likh donga.
Wassalam
- swagutt - 04-02-2010
"""""There was a time when muslims were striving to convert others to Islam.
Now we always keep looking how some one can be kicked out of this Islamic circle.
Result is so clear as some one explained keh hamein har jaga kyun maar par rahi hai.""""
Very well said Mr. Kamran realy appreciate what you have pointed Out!! )
- kamranACA - 04-02-2010
Dear
Allah ke rehmat hai keh sharaafat, ikhlaaq aur ikhlaas waaley loge aaj bhi zinda hain; aur woh aalim bhi jin ko Allah ke wilaayet haasil hai. Allah ka deen tu kaamil hai aur Allah ka nizaam bhi chalna hai, the issue is about what we are and what are those on whom general public largely base its faith considering them as ilam wala.
Yahi so-called "ilam waaley" hain jo pooray Pakistan ka aman tabah kar rahey hain, directly or indirectly. Logon ko sar-e-aam koray maartay hain, goliyaan barsaatey hain, bomb phortay hain, Jannnat kay ticket detay hain, sar-e-aam Muslims ke gardanein kaat daaltay hain aur uss par fakhar kartay hain, 17 crore logon ko munaafiq aur wajab-ul-qatal kehtay hain, aur poori dunyaa main Muslims ko gandda kar rahey hein.
Yahi Islaam kay thekadaar hain jo har kisi ko kaafir qaraar detay hain, samjhaanay par bhi baaz nahi aatey, logon kay eemaan par ungliyaan uthaatay hain, aur self-asssumed authorities ka parchaar kartay rehtay hain (jo inn jaahilon ko kahin na Islam nay dee hai naa Qaanoon nay).
Allah say duaa karein keh Allah muslims ko iss tarah kay jaahilon say panaah ata farmaaey aur sahi raastay par chalnay ke taufeeq ata karey.
Regards,
- awaisaftab - 04-02-2010
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, san" id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Toronto_Boy</i>
<br /><blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, san" id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by awaisaftab</i>
<br />Dear Toronto Boy I will talk with you on Saturday or Monday.
Filhal baqi questions ko choro see the following links and just give answer of Q-6
http//www.youtube.com/watch?v=MjcCn6kIAF0&playnext_from=TL&videos=Y9nXB6btsCI&feature=sub
http//www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ONXg1_AZ7s&feature=related
http//www.tanzeem.org/announcements/zaid%20hamid2.pdf
Kia 3 Aalim jin main se Dr. Israr ko mere khayal main sabhi mante hain jhoot bol rahe hain ????? Kia Akela Zaid Hamid Sacha ha.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></font id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Awais Sahib
Mayri post ka maqsaad app say bahas karna nahi hay, aur nahi lambi lambi post karkay apna ya readers ka waqt zaya karna hay.
Haan iss tamam soorat-e-haal main jo mayri samjh main aya wo main nay pahlay bhi byan kia tha aur mazeed byan kardia hay. In essence, mayray khayal main iss tamam maslay ki haysiat storm in a cup of tea say zyada nahi hay. Agarcha dosray muslims par iss tarha ki onglian othanay kay buhat bhayanak natayaj nikaltay hain. Yahi baat main samjhanay ki koshish karraha hon. Iss tamam exercise say sirf intishaar payda hosakta hay jo pahlay hi buhat zyada hay aur mazeed barh raha hay. Iss baat ka andaza iss baat say bhi lagaya jasakta hay kay sirf chand dino kay under iss muaamlay ki aaar main (mayray khyal main) kisi teesray fareeq (3rd party) nay aik jayad aalim ko Qatal kar dya hay aur oska ilzam aik doosray muslim (Zaid Hamid) par jaaraha hay. Nateeja kia hay, Pakistan aur muslims kay dusman apni apni dushmania iss maslay kay pichay nikaal rahay hain.
Agar iss baat ko mazeed aagay barhaya gya to aagay bhi yahi nataij niklain ga.
Mayray khyal main mayra point of view readers par kafi clear ho chuka hay. Agar main nay mazeed zaroorat samjhi, interest aur time hoa to mazeed likh donga.
Wassalam
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></font id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Dear Toronto Boy
No Aalim of any sect support so called Terhrik e Taliban Pakistan this is on record that even Mullah Umer and former leaders of Talban led Afghan Government have clearly denied any link with Tehrik âe-Taliban Pakistan beside it the ex official of Taliban led govt. also criticized the suicide attack by Tehrik e Taliban Pakistan. The unanimous opinion of Ulema has come which declares suicide attacks as against the teachings of Islamic. Gen. Hameed Gull and Gen. Hamid Navaz, ex interior minister, have opinion that India and Israel were involved in swat beside it many intelligence reports are the proof of this fact. During Swat operation armed forced caught many people who were non-Muslims. Kuch dead bodies jo mili hain fighters ki wo circumcision k baghair theen. The illiteracy, unemployment, poverty were major causes of Swat trouble. The foreign intelligence agencies use these social evil and exploit the religious sentiments of local people beside all the drown attacks by U.S forces played work of oil on fire in then prevailing situation.
There is need of analysis of foreign policy regarding U.S and Afghanistan and U-Turn in Afghan policy of Pakistan after 9/11. I donât want to say anything for or against Taliban Govt. but example of Iran is before us. Although Iran Govt. has reservations and conflicts with Taliban Govt. but Iran did not become the part of that exercise rather Irani Govt. and people had a desire of winning of war by Taliban.
(which was much difficult in then prevailing situation)
Simple America conquered Afghanistan after US control at Afghanistan India established relation with karzai Govt. The political analysts were raising issue of establishing number of high commissions by India in Afghanistan . These high commissioners were involved in the swat valley. How some non trained people can fight for many months with the most disciplined army of the world??. How these so called Taliban had got such heavy weapons ???
Ek waqay swat k hawalay se likh don hamare muhale k madarse main ek larka parhta ha jis ka taluq swat se ha us k eek relative swat ki ek masjid ke Imam hain. Imam sahib ne ek bar Jume k khutbe main swat k Taliban pe tanqeed kee sakht alfaz main. Raat ko un Aalim ka saga Bhanja jo Taliban ka saathi tha aya aur bare muadib andaz main arz kia kâ Mamoon Jan kal Sabah Fajir kee Namaz ke baad apko Zebah ker dia Jay gaâ. Beherhall raton raat jerga munaqad hua aur bohat sare mouzizzeen ko beech main dala gaya tab un aalim ke jan bakhshy huyee.
As far as Zaid Hamid is concerned no one kicks a dead dog have you seen his program at Minare Pakistan in which only few dozens people could be seen including camera men. I think this issue has resolved bulk apne mantaqi anjam ko phonch gaya. After all my reservations about him I donât think Zaid Hamid as Non Muslim.
At this thread I was compelled to use rough language ( by continuous personal attacks for last two months)I am ignoring personal attack for last two month not only at this thread but also at many other threads. This fact will be acknowledged by all of you that I am showing patience for many months but my tolerance was seemed as my weakness. Many people (i.e Ajnabi,Great Khan,Dard, Schuaeb,ysir,tariq sohail and June 23 a.m) pointed out misbehave of a member but all efforts were remain fruitless. After all in future I will try my best to avoid rough language.
Dear Toronto Boy
Difference of opinion apni jaga main ap k opinions ka ehtram kerta hun differences to family members k dermian tak hote hain lekin ikhtilafe ray ko zati dushmanion main tabdeel nhn kerna chaye. Mazee main mere ap k sath bohat achay taluqat rahay hain we never involved in personal attack on each other but at this thread main ne observe kia ke apne baaz jaghon pe thoree sakht zuban use kee. Anyhow I expect a good relation with you in future.
Thanks and warm regards,
Awais Aftab
- kamranACA - 04-02-2010
Dears
Last post of this man used a bit of sense although the purpose of thread was disputed, biased, senseless and derogative.
I have already suggested that "achay bachhay ban jaao tu sab theek hai"; aur agar nahi bano gey tu durgat tu pehlay bhi bani hai (kai aik members say) aur mazeed banti rahey gee. Chaahey koi baat tumhaari weekness ho ya strength iss say koi faraq nahi parnay wala.
Jab jab iss kay saath misbehave hua hai uskay peechay iskee koi nihaayet ghatya harkat maujood thee. Buhat saari examples main dey chuka hoon where he has opened his mouth about Karachiites, Sects, Languages, etc for no reason and no provocation and one example where he has indirectly declared to have a ticket or license of heavens showing immense Takabbar and jahaalat. One example is of this thread where he left no stone unturned to defame a muslim. At another place he tried to soil the faith of our fellow GreatKhans after which he has almost given up appearing on the forum. So, buhat saari misaalein hain. Agar yeh apna analysis khud karey aur aainda aisee harkaat say ijtenaab karey tu koi issue he nahi hai.
Yes, I have already cautioned him keh koi aur isske ghalat harkat point out karey ya na karey, main zaroor karoon gaa because he has been given margin of errors so many times. Isko yeh misbehave samjhta hai tu samjhtaa rahey. Jo iskay khayal main misbehave point out kar hukay hain woh tu khud time and again iski tabiat saaf kar chukay hain ghatya baaton ke wajah say. Uss baat ke misaal yeh kabhi nahi dey gaa. Khair kiyaa detail main jana; sab ko ilam he hai isskaa.
Torontoboy has very well said that har baat par âchillâ nahi kia jaa sakta; and I personally believe some one must take a step to answer the non-sense because it has already been destroying our society extremely.
So, hoping to see him âacha bachaâ in his next posts; I too close down this topic. However, I am here if some need will arise.
Regards,
KAMRAN.
- MRS - 04-03-2010
These were the words of George Bush after 9/11
â Either you are with us or you are with themâ
This is a mindset of a rigid person and no doubt the same mindset can be found in abundance in our country. Thatâs why any one who disagrees with them is labelled as agent of an Israeli or Indian lobby. These so called self appointed custodians of Islam has been given free hand to declare any one disagreeing with them as kafir. One try to talk with reasoning and they will catch your words twist it and display a meaning which was never meant by one. To prove their point they will even borrow the point of view of their rivals just because it meets their objective. They give status to the scholars of Islamic jurisprudence equal to the Prophet and their understanding cannot be challenged. You have no right to disagree with them. All you are allowed is to remain silent. They have killed many innocent people in the name of Blasphemy even the likes of Dr. Israr Ahmed were not spared and has been virtually banned on most of the channels just because he spoke a truth which we are not ready to buy.
They are not ready to accept that one can be neutral and argue on merits rather than on personal liking and disliking. They say if you are not against Zaid Hamid then you are with him.
They have destroyed the entire society in last sixty years and are still dreaming of conquering the entire world. Their house is on fire and they are arguing who has set it on fire. They are in minority but their views are imposed on majority as majority has been kept uneducated so that they cannot ask questions. In fact asking questions on Islam is discouraged so that we keep on repeating what has been told to us. They know if we start thinking then their business will be over.
Shame on those who use religion to satisfy their ego. No point in arguing with them leave them at Allahâs disposal he will treat them accordingly.
Regards
M.Rizwan
- awaisaftab - 04-03-2010
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, san" id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by MRS</i>
<br />These were the words of George Bush after 9/11
â Either you are with us or you are with themâ
This is a mindset of a rigid person and no doubt the same mindset can be found in abundance in our country. Thatâs why any one who disagrees with them is labelled as agent of an Israeli or Indian lobby. These so called self appointed custodians of Islam has been given free hand to declare any one disagreeing with them as kafir. One try to talk with reasoning and they will catch your words twist it and display a meaning which was never meant by one. To prove their point they will even borrow the point of view of their rivals just because it meets their objective. They give status to the scholars of Islamic jurisprudence equal to the Prophet and their understanding cannot be challenged. You have no right to disagree with them. All you are allowed is to remain silent. They have killed many innocent people in the name of Blasphemy even the likes of Dr. Israr Ahmed were not spared and has been virtually banned on most of the channels just because he spoke a truth which we are not ready to buy.
They are not ready to accept that one can be neutral and argue on merits rather than on personal liking and disliking. They say if you are not against Zaid Hamid then you are with him.
They have destroyed the entire society in last sixty years and are still dreaming of conquering the entire world. Their house is on fire and they are arguing who has set it on fire. They are in minority but their views are imposed on majority as majority has been kept uneducated so that they cannot ask questions. In fact asking questions on Islam is discouraged so that we keep on repeating what has been told to us. They know if we start thinking then their business will be over.
Shame on those who use religion to satisfy their ego. No point in arguing with them leave them at Allahâs disposal he will treat them accordingly.
Regards
M.Rizwan
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Rizwan jab behas end pe ha to yeh koshish honee chaye k mazeed uljhao na peda ho .Aap ne bhee to Ulema ke hawalay se bat kee thee Ghazway Hind k uper . Zahiri baat ha k sare ulmah to ek jaise nhn hain. Ap ne Dr. Israr ka zikar kia ha mujh ko moujooda mamle ka achi tarah ilm ha. Main Dr. Israr kee bohat izat kerta hun but ager hum Dr. Israr ke current mozu pe behas karainge to waqayee ek na khatam hone walee sectarian larayee shroo ho jay gi.
Its a request k behas ko samethnay kee koshish kerain jo ikhtilafat Ulema 1400 main khatam nhn kersake,halanke unke pas baherhal hum se ziada ilm tha, hum kis trah khattam ker saktain hain. Ab app yeh poochaygay k main ne yeh thread shru qun kia to iska jawab ha k Is thread ka maqsad sirf Zaid Hamid k bare main information dena tha.
Waise bhee ab Zaid Hamid Qissay Pareena ban chuka ha aur is thread ka maqsad pura ho chuka ha.Main ne ap se request kee hai agay mamla ap k hath main hai.
- awaisaftab - 04-03-2010
Har kisi k pas zuban ha aur do hath bhee hain koyee jo chay likh sakta ha koyee dosra usko rok nhn sakta we don't know personally about majority of members. Whenever I will feel k mere sath misbehave huwa ha main dobara moonh tor jawab donga. Koyee kisi ghalat fhemi main na rahe. Yahan ek do dafa hi iskee main ne class li to tabiat saaf ho gaye . Mager ab yeh galion pe uter aya. Jis ko log itnee izat dtain hain aur bhayee bhayee kehtay hain usne apna Bud Batin logon k samne sabit ker dia. Galion har koyee de sakta ha net pe ap kisi ka kuch nhn bigar sakte. Hum logon ne mukhtalif logon aur members k zehan main khake banaye hue hain yeh khake hum uski zuban k istimal aur jo alfaz woh use kerta ha unke base pe banatain hain. Ek banda jo galian de raha ho us k kirdar, social background ,professionalism k bare main log kia ray rakhain gay mujh ko batane kee zaroorat nhn ha. Abhi ek thread chall raha tha IQ k hawale se wahan aisay aisay personal attack huy k sharam aati ha but administration has not taken any action. Kehne ka maqsad yeh ha k koyeee galion main bohat agay nikal sakta ha koyee khas restriction nhn ha but logon ko pata chal jata ha k yeh banda kitna ghatiya ha. Log tarle to dalain gay ap k agay but ap logon ke nazron se gir jain gay. Ho sakta ha k mere kuch views ghalat hon lekin main ne kabhi gali ka jawab gali se nhn dia qun k meri tarbiat isi tarah huyee ha.
Jhan tak durgat ki baat ha to in mohtram ko great khan ne ek dafa whaila admi bhee keh dia tha lekin yeh bardasht ker gay. Qun k is ko pata tha k great khan iski mazeed kia durgat bana sakta ha. Pracs , Mroneflower aur dosron ne jo durgat banayee ha mujh ko pata ha.Main un k link yahan de sakta hun lekin yeh gatia harkatina ghatia log hi kerte hain Mere samne yeh is liay chora ho raha ha qun k is ko pata ha k main gali ka jawab gali se nhn deta is ka andaza is ko Is recession Really Here wale thread pe huwa.
Jhan tak Karachi walon kee baat ha to mere dil main un se koyee bughaz ya nufrat nhn ha yeh log hamare liay qable izat hain qun k in k buzurgon ne deen k liay hijrat ki. But Karachi walon se is baat pe iktilaf ha k wo jo claim kerte hain k Karachi pure mulk ko 70% revenue deta ha. Lekin is tarah ka ikhtilaf mujh ko qoumparst sindhion aur pathanon se bhe ah. Ap log ager dekhna chate hain ke Karachi k mamle pe behas kis tarah shroo huyee to thread dekh lain âIs recession really hereâ. Us thread pe baat challi thee ehle zuban kee k kon urdu ka ahle zuban ha is ne bhee apne remarks diay aur main ne bhee taqreeban same remarks diay lekin kuch arse bad ek member aya Spectrum usne meri simple see post ko reply ker k seedhi seedhi Punjab ko galian deen jawaban main ne bhee kuch sakht posts keen bad main yeh spectrum musalsal galian deta raha. Great Khan ek senior shaks hain mager unka kirdar bhee whan pe kuch positive nhn raha. Asal behas kee jar Spectrum tha jo yahan pe mess create ker k chala gaya mera sakht moqif great khan kee waja se nhn tha balke spectrum kee waja se tha mager great khan ne bhee bad main kafi sakht discussion huyee. Whan log itna agay barh gay thay k ek sahib ne ek video ka link de dia is video main Pakistan Army ko Indian army ke samne Dhaka main surrender kerte huy dikhaya gaya tha aur back ground main Pakistan ka qoumi Tarana baj raha tha. Is video ko dekh ker mujh ko inthayee afsoas huwa balke ap keh sakain hain main zehni tor pe hil ke reh gaya.
Jald hee mujh ko ehsas ho gaya k jo kuch ho raha ha ghalat ho raha ha main ne apnee tamam posts delete keen baghair kisi pressure ke aur great khan se request kee k app bhee apnee posts delete ker dain mager unhon ne koyee response na dia. Main ne admin se request kee mager whan se bhee koyee jawab na aya.( Mere liay jo cheez masla ker rahi thee wo galian theen jo Punjab ke Khilaf likhee gayee theen. Werna abhee bhee spectrum sahib ke wo qaseeday whan mojood hain jo unhon ne meri shan main kahe mujh ko to yeh shaks bhee galian de raha ha mager main ne kisee ko nhn kaha k is ko pressurize kero Is k ilawa mujh ko dar tha k kisi bhee waqt dobara shaded kisim kee jang saktee ha Punjabi Muhajir k mamle per) Akkir main jab kuch na ban saka to main ne is ko mail kee jis ka zikar yeh koyee 100 dafa ker chukka ha us waqt main is k bare main samajta tha k yeh Punjab se belong kerta ha. Mail is liay kee thee k jin posts main Punjab k khilaf batain hain unko delete kerwaya jay .Main to discussion se nikal aya tha apnee sari posts delete ker k mere liay kia tension thee ager mujh ko apne khilaf likhe gayee batain delete kerwanee hotin to spectrum ki galian abhi bhee mojood hain main unko delete kerwane k liay bohat kuch ker sakta tha mager main ne kabhi apnee zaat k liay koshish nhn kee. Anyhow mera is ne meree request pe ek kaam kia baat beshak Punjab kee thaee but request main ne hee kee thaee iss Ahsane Azeem k liay main iska shukria ada kerta hun. Mager yeh abtak 100 dafa us mail ka dhandora peet chukka ha. Ager is ko shoq ha to wo mail yahan baqida ek thread banay acha sa title rakhay aur whan paste ker de mujh ko koyee eitraz nhn ha.
Ye shaks jab arbitrator k tor pe us thread pe meree request pay aya to is ne whan likha tha ke yeh saree larayee action reaction or reaction action kee wajah se huyee. Yeh bat is ne sahi kahi thee
Main ne yeh saree explaination is liay dee ha ke yahan propaganda kia ja rah ha ke main ne ethnics kee buniyad pe fasad berpa kerne kee koshish kee thee. Asal jang spectrum ne shroo ke thee meree jis post k reply main Punjab ko galian deen theen wo post taqreeban same to same is shaks kee post ke tarah he thee jo is ne whan kee thee. Ager mujh ko lasani fasadat kerwanay kee koshissh ka mujrim qarar dia jata ha to phir is ko bhee dia jay. Beherhal main isko ilzam nhn de raha na Great khan ko asal fasad ke jar Spectrum tha.
Han ek baat reh gayee CA walon kee asal main is ko asal chur mugh se isi liay ha k is k khayal main mujh ko CA walon se sakht dushmanee ha. Dears professional competition apnee jagah but main CAâs k liay koyee bughaz nhn rakhta. Mere kayee friend CA.s hain. Main to aesay aesay logon ko janta hun jo big firms main higher officials hain. Ager kisi ko andaza kerna ho to mery post purh le Code of Corporate Governance pe aur mukhtalif jaghope jo information main ne likhi hai wo mujh ko ACAâs ne hee dee thee ACAâs bhe wo jo big four k sath hain. Mere bohat sare teachers jinhon kee main dill se izat kerta hun CAâs hain.
Chalo man latin hain thoree dare ke liay ke tum ne jo misbehave kia uska jawaz tha but yeh misbehave to uswaqt bhee nazar aata ha jab mujh ko is forum ka member banay huyee juma juma 8 din huy tha. What was the logic of that misbehave. This Question should must be replied on some logical basis.
- kamranACA - 04-03-2010
MRS,
My brother, we must thank to almighty Allah that has made the persons who have learnt to speak truth even in the era about which Prophet PBUH's prophecies make it too clear that truth speaking will be too difficult.
Obviously, we all are seeing and have been witnessing where have we been landed and how the religion is being used for assuming authorities, judging faiths, declaring muslim/non-muslim, declaring others maghrab zada, NGO zada and buying/selling heavens licenses.
I believe in this era it is inevitable to face illiterate mindset, reply their negativities coherrently and to develop courage to curb out their evil activities.
I appreciated your posting the detailed analysis about Ghazva-e-Hind (written by an aalim-e-din) and I also appreciate your true concern about the ugly face of so-called leaseholders of Islam.
Keep on posting things of wisdom and true justification.
All other readers,
Baat Punjab ke ho ya Sindh ke no body here wishes to act against the common well being of our country Pakistan and as such all provinces and ethnic groups are brothers to each other.
However, jab bhi aik aadmi ko mauqa milay aur woh ethnicity basis par apna zehar ugalna shuroo kar dey tu loge uski trouser utaar he detay hain. Yahi iss "parrot" kay saath hua. Iss main na Spectrum ka qasoor thaa aur naa Greatkhans ka. Ab agar aap jee bhar kay zehar ugal lain, bakwaas kar lein, aur phir mujhay bachaao mujhay bachaao cheekhtay phirain tu loge aap ko kia kahein gey??
Kuch cats and dogs (and also one insect) yahan thay jin ko sirf aik aadmi nay face kiaa and eventually those cats and dogs reached to their conclusion. Every one knows that when you are to save something, you have to face the hardships and inconveniences specially jab wasta cats and dogs say para ho; iss samajh say baalaa tar shakhs ko zara time lagay ga samjhnay main. Majority of those cats and dogs was thoroughly proved as liers and fabricators and their face was shown to public at large. Aisay logon kay lawyers ko bhi aakhir andaza ho gaya tha keh unkay clients jhootay hain aur bakwaas kartay hain. Abb yeh naya uthaa hai cats and dogs ka lawyer, ya representative.
Ohh bhayya kuch aqal say kaam lo. Proven aur dhatkaarey huey liers kee baat karo gey jo jhootay designations use kartay thay aur 2 accounts say message post kartay thay khud ko sacha saabit karnay kay liye tu un main he shumaar ho jaao gey. Apni rahi sahi patt bachaao, kyun apni izzat kaa lehaaz nahi tum ko??
Jahaan tak is kay reference kee baat hai tu yeh itnaa jaahil hai keh PRACS ka naam bhi likh diyaa iss nay jo aik nihaayat reasonable aadmi hai and who is like my brother. Abhi aap khud andaza laga lain iski zehni haalat aur zehar ugalnay ke tendency ka. Kuch socha na samjha bass likh diyaa. Aaj tak yahi aik baat hai jo isko marwa rahi hai.
Tabiat ke saffaai ke baat karta hai. Yeh nadaan bhatka hua bacha karey ga he kiaa? Abhi aik umar chaahiyey isko sirf understanding clear karnay kay liye. Actually issko aaj tak samajh he nahi keh tabiat ke saffaai kisko kehtay hain. Kabhi apni izzat kaa ehsaas hua aur kabhi issko pata chala keh "sharam" kia hoti hai tu shaayed tab thora pata chalay ga issko iss baat kaa. (Mainay kaha tha topic close kar doon, laikan nahi). Aur yahi harkat iss nay hamesha ke hai. Spectrum aur GreatKhans ka naam leta hai yeh, abhi un main say koi bhi jawab denay aa gaya tu isskee patloon geelee ho jaani hai. Ab yeh kahey ga keh misbehave ho raha hai. Ohh bhayya unkay saamnay ghighee bandhi hoti hai tumhaari, aur ab pata hai woh nahi hain tu bharkain maar rahay ho.
Aik baat agar damaagh main aa sakay tu samajh lo, kaam aaey ge. Kisi illogical aur ghair ikhlaaqi baat kay saamnay sach ka saath dena aur uskay liye cats and dogs ke bhaaon bhaaon ke parwah na karna aur baat hai, AUR, apni persistent kam aqli, bey sharmi aur ghalat zehni kaifiyet ke wajah say bey izzati karwaaey jana doosri baat. Issi liye Jehad aur aam Laraai main buhat bara faraq hai jab keh nuqsaan tu dono taraf ka hota hai. (Just an example). Baat samajh jaao gey tu umar bhar kaam aaey gee, nahi samjho gey tu baqaol tumhaari bhaaoon bhaaon kay main waila aadmi tu hoon he, yaheen umar guzray gee tumhaari meray saath. Inshallah.
Qibla achi tabiyat waaley bhaai sahib farmaatay hain keh yeh ghatya harkat nahi kartay lehaza koi link post nahi karein gey. Mashallah kiaa cheez hain yeh. Zaleel harkatein jin ke wajah say yeh saari behas hai woh theen kiyaa? Zaid Hamid kay baarey mein link post karna. Kaun kaun saa link post nahi kiaa iss nay aik Zaid Hamid ko kaafir saabit karnay kay liye; aur itnay naik hain keh aisee "ghatya harkatein" tu yeh kartay he nahi. Kia baat hai.
Har shakhs nay issko iss thread par samjhaya hai par yeh baaz nahi ayaa and now like pigeon has closed his eyes and says iss thread ka maqsad pooraa ho gaya hai aur Zaid maazi ka qissa ban gaya hai. Piyaarey, Zaid ko jo nahi bhi jaantay thay woh bhi iss thread ke wajah say jaan gaey hain, jo usko pasand nahi bhi kartay, unhon nay bhi teri kareeh harkat kee wajah say usko support kia hai; aur tu kehta hai maqsad pooraa ho gaya hai.
Mainay aik post main detail say analysis diyaa thaa baaqi muamaalaat kaa bhi jahaan teray jaisay samjhtay hain unkaa maqsad pooraa ho chukaa hai. Zyada detail main jana chaahtay ho tu bata denaa.
Abhi doston say ijaazat, kal phir miltay hain issi jaga issi thread par, issi mauzoo par, non-sense ko face karnay kay liye aur suitable reply denay kay liye.
Regards,
- Toronto_Boy - 04-03-2010
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, san" id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by awaisaftab</i>
... Mazee main mere ap k sath bohat achay taluqat rahay hain we never involved in personal attack on each other but at this thread main ne observe kia ke apne baaz jaghon pe thoree sakht zuban use kee. Anyhow I expect a good relation with you in future.
Awais Aftab
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Bhai Awais
Mayray dil main bhi apki janib koi kadoorat nahi hay. Main yahan yah wazah kardon kay main nay apkay yani "Awais Aftab" kayliay mayray khyal main intentionally koi sakht zaban istimaal nahi ki hay. Haan main iss general idealogy say zaroor ikhtilaaf rakhta hon jis ki waja say yah thread start hua. Agar phir bhi aap yah samajhtay hain kay main nay aapkay liay koi sakht alfaz kahay hon to mayri janib say maazrat qobool karain.
Kutch aakhri alfaz kay tor par main yah zaroor kahna chahonga kay kutch mamlaat buhat nazuk hotay hain jaysay zaat paat, lissan, aur deen-o-mazhab waghaira. Inn par kutch kahnay say pahlay kafi ghor karlayna chahyay khas toor par Deen kay baray main baat karnay say pahlay. Khas toor par ham muslims kayliay yah buhat aham maslaa hay.
Bhai mayray, mujhay yahan bhi aapsay ikhtilaaf hay kay sab Ulema nay suicidal attacks aur taliban kay khilaaf fatwa dya hay. Kam az kam mayri nigah say itni lambi list of Ulema's nahi guzri jinhon nay taliban kay khilaaf fatwa dya ho. Balkay mayray ilm aur samjh kay mutabiq to chand big ulema kay ilawa majority (including big mazhabi political leaders and a mazhabi political party) to talibaan kay darparda saathi hain, onhain moral support kartay hain, onkay liay rai-aamma hamwar kartay hain, onko aur khud ko aik hi sikkay kay do (two) rokh kahtay hain, kahtay hain kay sirf "<b>zara sa</b>" tariqay ka farq hay.
Mayray bhai, kia ham roz marrra main aik doosray kay baray main yah nahi kahtay kay falan tu wahabi hay, falan tu shea hay, ya falan punjabi/sindhi/pathan etc. hay. Bhai, yah sab batain deemak ki tarha hoti hain, deemak ki tarha amal karti hain, aahista aahista society main intishaar payda karti hain, bhai ko bhai say larati hain, muslim ko muslim ka dushman banati hain. Agar hamara aapas main yah haal hay tu aqliaton (minoroties) kay saath hamara kia sulook hoga. Ham sabko maloom hay kay ham onkay saath kia sulook rawa rakhtay hain. Bhai, kia as Pakistani tamam minorities ko equal rights nahi honay chayay. Kia ham practically equal rights daytay bhi hain onko apni individual day to day life main? Aap khud apnay aap say inn questions ka jawab thanday dil sochain.
Bhai, deen main tu narmi, tadabbur, aur tahamul hay. Iss waqt sub-continent (bar-e-sagheer) main total world muslim population kay taqreeban 50% muslims rahtay hain. Ham khud kahtay hain kay yahan Islam sufis aur arab traders nay phaylaya. Tu bhai kia onhon nay ghair muslims kay saath istarha ka sulook kia tha jaysa aaj ham apnay hi muslim bhaion kay saath kartay hain? Kia onhon nay dosray muslims kay 10 ya 15 saal puranay relations (baqool Kamran garay murdon say) ginway thay? Bhai, agar unn Sofia karaam aur arab traders ka aysa amal hota to shayad aaj ham main say koi muslim hi sub-continent main mojood nahi hota. Bhai kia ham aik doosray ki tangain hi iss tarha nahi kaat rahay hain? Kia ham doosron ko hansnay ka moqa nahi day rahay hain? Kia ham iss tarha kay baykaar muaamlaat main apni hi energies zaya nahi karrahay hain? Jabkay aaj hamain unity ki pahlay say zyada zaroorat hay, ham kia mazeed bikhar nahi rahay hain?
Bhai aaj ki dunya main mukhtalif tarha kay groups hotay hain, jinkay apnay apnay interest hotay hain, wo apnay apnay interests creat kartay hain aur protect kartay hain. Jab onkay interests par zarb parti hay ya tanqeed hoti hay tu wo bhi mukhalif party par directly aur "<b>INDIRECTLY</b>" hamlay kartay hain aur onko giranay ki koshish kartay hain, by hook or by crook. Bhai, hamaray mulk main illetracy pahlay hi buhat zyada hay. Kam az kam educated logon ko tu cheezon ko thora deeply analyze karna chayay. Aksar cheezain jiss tarha hamain roz-marra main dikhai dayti hain, aksaar waysi asal main hoti nahi hain, balkay onkay pichay koi aur baat ya maqsad chupa hota hay. Bhai kam az kam educated logon ko tu sabar say, soch samjh kar qadam uthana chayay. Ya phir Punjab kay village ki tarha jab kisi sakhs nay apnay neighbour say dushmani aur makhaasmat nikalni thi tu os nay village molvi ko jaakar kah dya kay osnay Naoozubillah Quraan jalatay daikha hay aur molvi sahib nay masjid kay loud speaker par chillana aur logon ko oksana shoru kardya aur phir os hafiz-quraan ko public lynching say shaheed kardya gya.
Kia Zaid Hamid kay muaamlay main bhi yahi kutch tu nahi horaha?
Bhai, Yosuf Ali kay muaamlay main bhi kam az kam Pakistan ki had tak hi Ijma-e-umat ya tamam firqon kay fiqaheen ka Ijmaa to karlaytay jo sab milkar kutch decide karta aur qom ka ospar consensus hota, phir osko akhri adalaat (Supreme Court ya Federal Shariat Court) tak lay kar jatay, wahan say faysla laytay, aur phir Gov't jo bhi saza dayti aur ospar amal karti. Bhai yah to Ulema ki zimmaydari thi kay "Yousuf Ali" ki "HIFAZAT" kartay aur logon aur awam ko samjhatay kay wo Naozubillah agar nabuwat ka dawaydaar hay to koi ordinary muslim ossay koi nuqsaan nahi pohancha day.
Aur hoa iskay bur-aks, kisi nay thik tariqa istimaal nahi kia, individual level par fatway barish ki bondon ki tarha tapaknay lagay, na hi tamam fiqaheen ka ijmaa hoa, na baat mulki insaaf ki aakhri adaalat tak pohanchi, aur aik emotional, short sighted, cold blooded murderer nay "Yousuf" ko Qatal kar dya. Khas kam jahan pak. Chalo qissaa hi tamam hua. Ab koi molvi hazraat kay khilaaf nahi bolay ga.
Bhai mayray, kisi ko non-muslim qarar dayna ya "kazib" kahna kia mamooli baat hay kia? Har baat kay kutch khas taqazaay hotay hain. Kia kisi makhsoos firqay ya chand firqon kay Ulema kay individual fatwon say koi bhi muslim ya dosray muslim firqay non-muslim qarar paa saktay hain? Bhai agar aysa hay tu phir sab ko aik doosray kay khilaaf talwarain otha layni chayay aur sab ko aik doosray ki gardan zani kardayni chahyay. Door ki baat choryay, issi waja say Para Chinaar, Hungo, aur FATA main yah sab ho hi raha hay. Aur ham sab big cities main rahnay walay aam muslims bhi dosron kay liay dilon main bughz liay baythay hain, farq sirf yah hay kay FATA main amal horaha hay aur ham karachi ya lahore main kar nahi paatay.
Bhai kahnay ka maqsaad yah hay kay "Yousuf Ali" ko kinaaray tak tu pohanchatay. Phir jab hujjat tamam hojati tu kisi ko ossay "kizaab" kahnay main koi shak ya diqqat nahi hoti.
Chalain agar tab nahi hoa to ab hi jo amal ho chuka osko thik karlain. Ab aap aur wo tamam dini hazraat jinko aik dafan shuda murday say Islam par koi aanch aati nazar aati hay, wo aagay aain aur kam az kam Pakistan kay tamam firqon kay aalimon say Yosuf kay muamlay par consensus develop karain aur koi collective result samnay lain. Oskay baad agar agar Pakistan ki Courts aur Law ijazat dayta ho to oskay case ko last court of law say decision karwain. Agar aysa nahi hota, tu bhai phir to log yousuf ali kay case ko bhi shak say daikhain gay aur Zaid Hamid par onglian othanay ko bhi ghalat kahain gay, kionkay jab aik bunyad (base) hi sabit (proved) nahi hay to oski bunyaad par khari imaraat (building) hi jhoti hay. Aur aysay logon ka maqsad sirf dosron ko dara dhamka kar, zor zabardasti, apni monoply banana, hat dharmi say apni baat manwana, aur apnay INTERSTS ko save karna hi hay. Warna phir aysay logon ka maqsad jo aik garay murday (long burried person) ko dobarah zindah karrahay hain, onka maqsaad sirf aaam musalmano ko darana hi hay kay jo bhi onkay khilaaf bolay ga wo usko aysi ibrat ki misaal bana dain gay. Agar inka yah maqsad nahi hay tu yah kisi kaam ko karnay ka aik thik aur jayaz tariqa-e-kaar kion ikhtiar nahi kartay? Kia iss tarha yah log aaam logon ko ya tu mushta-il karrahay hain ya phir harasaan nahi karrahay hain?
Bhai thik tariqay aur ghalat tariqay main baaz auqat sirf itna hi farq (difference) hota hay jitna nikkah aur muttaa main. Kaam aik hi hay, tariqa ghalat.
Mujhay educated logon say sirf yahi kahna hay kay apni affiliation ki waja say ghalat tariqay ko thik tariqay main khalat malat (mix-up) na karain aur na ossay support karain. Warna yahi hoga jo ho raha hay. Anarchy aur mazeed anarchy, intishaar aur mazeed intishaar. Natija, har shaks apna insaaf khud karnay lagay ga. Discourage karain iss approach ko aur har os approach ko jo distruction ki janib jati ho. Doosron kay eeman ko evaluate karna chor dain, ham main say kisi ko aysa koi deeni ya dunyawi haq nahi hay, aur nahi ham main ba-hay-siyat insaan aysi sallahiat hay kay ham dosron kay dilon main jhank sakain. Agar kutch aysay problems hon bhi jaysay Qadyanion ki tarha kay tu ossay settle karna buhat high level Ulema ka kaam hay jo unhain Ijmaa kay saath karna hoga. Warna muslims sirf bat-tay hi rahain gay.
Gen. Hameed Gul bhi Zaid Hamid ki tarha impractical batain hi kartay hain. Ya tu yah dono hazraat khud baywaqoof hain (jo yaqeenan ghalat hay), ya phir intihai chalaak jo aam Pakistanis ko apnay interests kayliay oksaatay aur mushta-il kartay hain. Yah Pakistanis kay India ya USA kay baray main sentiments ko exploit kartay hain. Aakhir Gen. Hameed Gul jitnay shad-o-mad say India's hand in Swat ki baat kartay hain utni hi taqat (power) say Taliban ki mukhalifat kion nahi kartay? Inhi jaysay elements phir Pakistani taliban jaysi terms laykar aatay hain aur kahtay hain kay Pakistani talibaan Afghan talibaan say seperate hain, jabkay Swat main taliban leader (I am forgetting his name) khud kahta hay kay wo Afghanistan main safe and sound hay. Gen. Hameed Gul ka saara zor sirf iss baat par hay kay riffle aur ammunition kahan say aaraha hay, jabkay ossay kon chalata hay yani taliban, tu onki wo koi burai iss shiddat say nahi kartay jaysi USA ya India ki kartay hain. Wo karain bhi kion, wohi to taliban kay creaters main shamil rahay hain. Ab taliban ko bura kahnay say zad to onpar bhi paray gi, aur anderoon-e-khana taluqat bhi kharab hongay. Ajeeb log hain ham bhi. Khoon aaasham wahshi kutttaay (wild dogs) bhi paltay hain aur chahtay hain kay wo kabhi ham par hamla bhi na karain.
Yahan main Kamran ki baat say bhi ittafaq karonga kay aaapnay un-intentionally Zaid Hamid ko market hi kardya hay yahan bhi. Ab daikhain mayri misal hi lain, main aap sab say koso door rahta hon aur Yousuf Ali ko tu main bilkul bhi nahi jantaa tha iss thread say pahlay. Zaid Hamid ko bhi chand baar TV ya websites par hi daykha tu tha magar mujhay oska naam (name) bilkul bhi maloom nahi tha kionkay ospar kabhi twaja hi nahi di. Magar iss sab kay baad dono kay naam aur kaam say aagahi hoi.
Umeed hay kay agar koi baat buri lagi ho tu ignore karain gay.
Wasalam
Note Tamam bhaion say guzaarish hay kay aik doosray say unlock hokay aur thori leverage daykar agay barhain aur zati shukriyay ka moqa dain. Umeed hay aap iss zati guzaarish ko qabil-e-tawaja samjhain gay.
- kamranACA - 04-03-2010
Torontoboy Brother,
Now you will see some further links to prove kay "Ulema" have consensus on Yousaf as well Zaid, and that consensus is so-called Ijmah-e-Ummah.
Aap nay sach tu bolaa hai laikan ho sakta hai aap kay baarey main bhi aik post kisi thread par aa jaaey "parrots" ke taraf say. Aap ko waqat say pehlay zehni taur par tayyaar karney kay liye kuch rattay rattaaaey expected paragraphs-
........................
When all authorities are vested with "Ulema", then supreme court or Federal Shariat Court does not make any sense. Why you are not aware of Ulema' authorities, vision and role?? Are you a true muslim? Or a Muslim first of all? Aap Yousaf ke aur Zaid ke tarafdaari kar rahey hein? Kiaa aap eeman ke sahi haalat main hain?? Kiaa aap unkay follower nahi?? Kiaa aap jannat main jana chaahtay hain jo yaqeenan aap jaisay haqeer maghrab zada logon kay liye aasaan nahi?? Tu phir aap woh karein jo ham kehtay hain. Apnaa eemaan explain karein sab say pehlay. Aap supreme court ko Ulema par fauqiyat kaisay dey saktay hain?? Aap tu maghrab zada lagtay hain, moderate/secular minded.
Abhi aap say "explanation maangi jaa rahi hai" aap kay eeman ka faisla nahi kia ja raha. Ab iss dauran koi parwana aap ko qatal kar dey tu Subhanallah.
Do you know "ulema" have the authority to call for explanation? Aap forann say pehlay Ulema kay qadmon main gir jaaein aur apnay kiye ke muaafi talab karein. Allah ka kia farman hai baad mein dekha jaaey ga laikan Ulema pehlay khud he nimat lain gey aap say. Aur aap ka wohi haal karein gey jo aap jaisay pehlon kaa kiaa hai.
Agar judges, commissioners aur police etc explanation maang saktay hain tu "Ulema" kyun nahi?? Bhaai khud socho?? Woh bhi aisay mulak main jahaan Govt khud sahi islaami na ho.
Lehaza aap girgara kar Ulema say muaafi aur bakhshish talab karein.
Iss post ka maqsad logon ko aap kee eemani haalat aur "fitna angaiz" baaton kay baarey main alert karnaa hai aur kuch nahi. Yeh koi Fatwa nahi. Bey shak ham nay saabit kar diya hai keh aap Yousaf Kazzab kay follower hain laikan phir bhi ham aap ko kaafir nahi kehtay. Bass logon ko alert kiaa hai ham nay. Aap foran explanation provide karein har Ulema ko.
Ab 3-4 pages ke behas kay baad (aur invariablly buhat say logon say jootay khaanay kay baad) ham keh dein gey keh iss post ka maqsad poora ho gaya aur aap maazi ka hissa ban gaey.
.......................
Allah muaaf rakhay "parrots" say. Yahaan kisi kaa eeman mehfooz nahi.
Regards,
- shani420 - 04-03-2010
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, san" id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by kamranACA</i>
<br />Torontoboy Brother,
Now you will see some further links to prove kay "Ulema" have consensus on Yousaf as well Zaid, and that consensus is so-called Ijmah-e-Ummah.
Aap nay sach tu bolaa hai laikan ho sakta hai aap kay baarey main bhi aik post kisi thread par aa jaaey "parrots" ke taraf say. Aap ko waqat say pehlay zehni taur par tayyaar karney kay liye kuch rattay rattaaaey expected paragraphs-
........................
When all authorities are vested with "Ulema", then supreme court or Federal Shariat Court does not make any sense. Why you are not aware of Ulema' authorities, vision and role?? Are you a true muslim? Or a Muslim first of all? Aap Yousaf ke aur Zaid ke tarafdaari kar rahey hein? Kiaa aap eeman ke sahi haalat main hain?? Kiaa aap unkay follower nahi?? Kiaa aap jannat main jana chaahtay hain jo yaqeenan aap jaisay haqeer maghrab zada logon kay liye aasaan nahi?? Tu phir aap woh karein jo ham kehtay hain. Apnaa eemaan explain karein sab say pehlay. Aap supreme court ko Ulema par fauqiyat kaisay dey saktay hain?? Aap tu maghrab zada lagtay hain, moderate/secular minded.
Abhi aap say "explanation maangi jaa rahi hai" aap kay eeman ka faisla nahi kia ja raha. Ab iss dauran koi parwana aap ko qatal kar dey tu Subhanallah.
Do you know "ulema" have the authority to call for explanation? Aap forann say pehlay Ulema kay qadmon main gir jaaein aur apnay kiye ke muaafi talab karein. Allah ka kia farman hai baad mein dekha jaaey ga laikan Ulema pehlay khud he nimat lain gey aap say. Aur aap ka wohi haal karein gey jo aap jaisay pehlon kaa kiaa hai.
Agar judges, commissioners aur police etc explanation maang saktay hain tu "Ulema" kyun nahi?? Bhaai khud socho?? Woh bhi aisay mulak main jahaan Govt khud sahi islaami na ho.
Lehaza aap girgara kar Ulema say muaafi aur bakhshish talab karein.
Iss post ka maqsad logon ko aap kee eemani haalat aur "fitna angaiz" baaton kay baarey main alert karnaa hai aur kuch nahi. Yeh koi Fatwa nahi. Bey shak ham nay saabit kar diya hai keh aap Yousaf Kazzab kay follower hain laikan phir bhi ham aap ko kaafir nahi kehtay. Bass logon ko alert kiaa hai ham nay. Aap foran explanation provide karein har Ulema ko.
Ab 3-4 pages ke behas kay baad (aur invariablly buhat say logon say jootay khaanay kay baad) ham keh dein gey keh iss post ka maqsad poora ho gaya aur aap maazi ka hissa ban gaey.
.......................
Allah muaaf rakhay "parrots" say. Yahaan kisi kaa eeman mehfooz nahi.
Regards,
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></font id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Funny and amusing.
U sound a bit like Shaikh Rasheed here.Mustaqbil ka naqsha hi khench dia!
- kamranACA - 04-03-2010
Torontoboy
Jahaan tak aap ke appeal (given in a note) ka ta-aluq hai, woh sab kay liye qaabil-e-qadar hai.
Mainay tu pehlay bhi likha hai keh "yeh saahib" khud ko theek kar lein aur aainda "acha bacha" honay ka wada karein tu sab theek ho jaaey ga. At least tab tak jab tak yeh "acha bacha" bana rahey. However, issko yeh baat raas nahi aai.
Ab aap jaantay hain main tu hoon he wailaa aadmi, tu khud he bataaiye kia nateeja niklay ga??
Yeh kehta hai keh meri posts dekh kar meray professionalism aur educational background ke samajh aati hai. Issko shaayed yeh maloom nahi keh mental hospital kay doctor professional honay kay baawajood paaglon kay doctor bhi hotay hain. So, unko aisa karna he parta hai.
Aur yahaan issi thread par yeh khud ko khud he "paagal" aur apni baat ko "paagal aadmi ke bakwas" keh he chuka hai. Mind it, these are not my words.
Anyway, acha bacha ban jaaey tu koi issue he nahi.
Regards,