Emergency Imposed by a Dictator

[Muhammad Amir]

Yar Imran Bhai You Can't put MMA and Imran Khan's name in the list of Benazir, Nawaz and others...

Concerns of people over MMA are due to their lack of team work...

Basically MMA consists of parties from different sectarian backgrounds like JUI, JI, JUP and others so their over all consented decision is some times against the thoughts of common people, same was the case on 17th ammendment when they gave MUZALLAL(Perveze) a chance to GHASAB the rights of nation, nevertheless MMA is a much better political party than other parties...

Regards,

Muhammad Amir

[israrhere]

I think we can get a better option agar Imran khan aur JI ekatte hojaye,
what do you think...?

[Muhammad Amir]

Dear Israr as said by Maulana Fazul-ur-Rahman that Imran Khan is still a "Na-Baligh Politician"...

Politics is best for the people who are calm, cool and control over their nerves, i sometimes see the statements of Qazi Hussain Ahmed Sahib and Imran Khan's and i feel very sorry to say that they have no bright future in politics, as you people are well aware that JUI is having the special majority in MMA and subsequently in National Assembly, Provncial Assembly, and in sennate, but just because of the extreme behaviour of Qazi sahib MMA lost their government in 2 provences, Aur Kuch Siasi Hoshiaroon ka kehna hay kay MMA kay Isteefay aur Benazir ki Zid Emmergency ka Mouajib Bani, Anyways...

Recently i saw a statement of Chairman of Tehreek-e-Istqlal Rehmat Khan Wardak sahib that this emmergency is imposed just because of the stubborn behaviour of Opposition....

although one can't claim this to be a pure cause, but statements of Rehmat sahib are aften very true(As he is the most senior politician of pakistan)...

Regards,

Muhammad Amir

[Sarfaraz]

Aslam u alaikum to all

What do you know that democracy is a religion in which goverment for the people and by the people and Rules are made in the parliment are made indirectly by the people;

now in islam Rules are made by ALLAH subhana wa ta'alla

anyhow kindly download and read the following booklet on it

http//www.jamatuddawa.org/data1/books/Khilafat%20&%20Jamhoriat/JamhooriatIslamiKaise.pdf

in google groups see islaminreality

[Sarfaraz]

See also this link

http//downloads.islambase.co.uk/booksEN/DemocracyReligion.pdf

[Imran]

Dear Aamir you are right about MMA but as the people trusted this party and after a long time public trusted Islamic Party. But they are unable to fulfill the demands of people of Pakistan as due to creation of disputes among themselves. But its only my point of view as i voted for this party last time. But this is the time that they should resolve their internal disputes and work togather for the true democracy and progress of the country plus erasing of bad opinions of the world for Pakistan

[Astute Accountant]

Hmmmmm MMA...... May Allah Almighty save Pakistan from MMA's rule coz I'm sure if they ever got power, they'll put the whole "country for sale".... I'd never ever vote for them.....

[kamranACA]

Dears,

It's every one's right to vote for his own choice and support the people liked by him/her. It's good if Astute does not like MMA and at the same time it is good if Amir likes them. This is what we call as democracy and forebearance.

I do not agree to Sarfraz regarding his comments about democracy although I do believe that everything is to be decided by ALLAH. ALLAH has left so much on his creature named human beings in this world. Human was made Khalifa by ALLAH. We have been given guidelines in broad spectrum so that we may develope rules in consonance of those broad spectrum guidelines. I can quote one hundred examples for it.

So much has been told and explained to us by the prophets (A.S.) and auliyas which was not explained directly in holy books and Sahifaa's. Thats why Hadees books have to be considered along with Holy Quran for understanding the religion. Then so much was corrected / improved by Khulfa-e-Rashideen. Systems were developed, boundries were fixed, army was established, Tadween of Holy Quran was made, issue of Taraaweeh prayers and lots of other matters were resolved.

Afterwards, the things explained by Imams and auliyas wherever required. Examples of those who provided us Tafaseer of Holy Quran and other material of knowledge could be quoted.

Running of govermental systems is also an art and comes from experience and knowledge. There had been no bar on developing systems and streamlining the methodologies. Democracy is one of such developments and in the context of huge masses living within muslim countries having different conceptual frameworks, it cannot be totally laid off by calling it some jewish or other development. Hikmat kee baat moman kee gumshuda meeraas hai. No doubt over it. What we have to do is, we should vote for right men (specially where minorities have limited specified seats in assemblies) and right parties. Those men always keep the constitution in their minds which establishes that president and prime minister would be muslims and country's official religion would be Islam and nothing against islam would be allowed etc.

We can customize everything to match our own heritage and belief. We must not simply ignore it randomly by saying that rules are to be made by ALLAH. ALLAH has given us rules which are very clear and all sub-rules and normal / routine life laws could be developed by us in consonance of those broad rules given by ALLAH. We have to depend upon men for this purpose who were prophets (A.S), Khulfaas (R.Z.), Imams or auliyas (R.A.), men of knowledge, men of exposure and so on. Otherwise you must know that God no where in any Holy Book directly prohibited humans from eating DOGS or any such other haram thing. We after all had to rely and make distinctions. This process has to continue for ever. This is just an example.

Now coming to the point of emergency. As per my apprehension, it was totally aimed to eliminate the judiciary that was now providing justice to every one and was very critical to the Musharraf's MANN MAANIES. This emergency has placed a judicial system which will not affect govermental issues and policies at all thus providing Musharraf further space to stay in power.

I wonder why we always say Musharraf is a slave or servant or agent of U.S. or jews etc. It is not anything like that. We have to analyze it from other view. The people like Musharraf have ever been faced by Pakistan becoz army is ruling Pakistan since ages. These people create every reason to stay in power and remain on seat. Thus they use U.S. and other agencies for their own interest. Do you guys feel Musharraf is doing it for U.S. In my view not at all. He is doing it for his own sake as it is the habit of our army. They feel satisfied only if they are in government. So while doing this all stuff for their own sake they do not leave any stone unturned. U.S. interests are one of those stones. It's the habit of muslims that they never show strong, logical, independent, diplomatic and honest stance. And just for prolonging their own position, they do everything. We must not allegate U.S. Kuffar has to do wrong with Islam. Question is, why muslims are doing same.

This is very controvercial !!!

I hope this Musharraf will be leaving very soon.

Let's hope for conversion of this hope into certainity.

Best regards,


Kamran.

[israrhere]

Dear Amir in my view emergency is not imposed due to the behaviour of MMA or other opposition parties but is imposed just because of the expected decision from the SC.You said that politics are best for those who are calm,cool and having controle over their nerves but in which sense it is best for them,to attain govt or to act according to their manshoor and Islamic agenda?
MMA was in govt in two provinces as people voted them because they were expecting a revolution but its sad that we didn't see even little changes in their govt.Baz kam jo MMA wale keh rahe hain ke unhe karne nahi deye jarahe te to pir mere khial se hukomt mai batne aur aik dictator aur us ke chamcho se deal ka koi jawaz nahi ta.You feel sorry for Qazi sahib and Imran khan but I feel sorry for the whole MMA because I don't think they will get anothor chance.

Dear Astute kia pakistan ko is hal tak MMA ne puhunchaya hai ya Benazir,Nawaz aur Musharraf ne?

Best Rgards,
Israr

[Muhammad Amir]

<b>Bhai Sarfaraz Sahib</b> you are 100% right and i am strong supporter of Jamat-ul-Dawwah(Because they are JEHADISTS), Democracy is the toy designed by KUFFARS(FARANGIES) to make muslims "GHAFIL" from "KHILAFAT" and ISLAM, Democracy(JAMHURIAT) is one of the best tactics of KUFFARS to Make Muslims their "GHULAM", That is why i will never caste my vote to MMA because they are asking to collect votes for "JAMHURIAT" which is the tool of KUFFARS, thats why casting votes to MMA in my point of view is NON ISLAMIC act, LAYKIN AGAR "MMA" WALAY SHRIAT NAFIZ KARNAY KAY LIAY BULAIN GY to i will be the first to die for SHRIAT...

<b>Dear IMRAN Bhai</b> Basically MMA is using the name of Islam and they asking to vote for "JAMHURIAT" this is the punishment of Allah for them because they are not working for Islam or KHILAFAT but for JAMHURIAT...

<b>Dear Astute</b> I will also not caste my vote to MMA but your statement is showing your prejudice against Mullahs, and by facts your statement is totally wrong because of the reasons given by bhai ISRAR...

<b>Dear Kamran Sahib</b> I can't materially disagree to you except your version regarding "Jmahuriat", and Bhai of what people you are talking and about what JAMHURIAT you are talking is it a JAMHURIAT to pass "Women Protection ACT", this bill was passed by PERVEZ MUZALLAL and Co. to fulfil their devilish needs and to promote their ________ business...

Regards,

Muhammad Amir

[Goodman]

Pakistan Army Private limited is a very profitable concern. Please be assured that it has no going concern problems. Therefore, my advice to masses (for whom life is continual process of fight against poverty) is

When rape is inevitable, open your legs and relax.

[Sarfaraz]

)

Hmm KamranACA sahab mashaALLAH se ap ACA ho gaye hain
your presentation is good

acha bhai plz Sura Baqra ki ayat # 216 plus Sura Tauba Ayat 24, 111 bhi explain kar dain ta k hum bhi ap se kuch seekh jain

aur bhain islam par to buhat research hai ap ki mashallah se

Abu bakr sadique razi allah k liye jo elections huway they un ki voters list agar ap k pass save hai to plz mujhe send kar dain

Iss k illawa Umer, Usman and Ali razi ALLAH k voters ki list bhi send kar dain ta k sab jaan lain k jamhuriat to bilqul hi islami cheez hai ....

[Sarfaraz]

http//tibyan.wordpress.com/

[kamranACA]

Dear sarfraz,

I just wonder on the plea taken about the appointment of Khulfaa-e-Rashideen (Rziallah) and its comparison to the current scenario.

If you reasonably see how Khulfaa-e-Rahsideen Raziallah Anhuma were selected, you will find a difference in the basis of selection of all the four Khulfaa's. (Raziallah).

In my view except for Hazrat Abu Bakar Siddique (that was what could be best done in favor of muslims), all Khulfaa's were elected exactly on democratic grounds. At that time masses / groups and areas were represented by the then tribes and in turn such muslim tribes were represented by their noble men having religious vision and importance. Those noble men of ALLAH were the people for whom no one had any doubts and there were no charges on any one of them at large (Naoozbillah). Therefore making a committe of noble and important men of character from different tribes to propose a name for next Khalifa in that particular scenario was not un-democratic. Rather, it was basically a first step towards democracy.

Further, the selection of Khalifa by the people who were present at mosque, was again showing a trend of democracy. This could be called a second step of democracy. We cannot at all ignore it. There was no enforcement or imposition.

Before Hazrat Umar Raziallah Anho, Muslims were not gathered and organzied in a form of state. There was no concept of boundries, kingdom, state, country, army and state systems. Everything has to be seen in conjuction of ground realities existed in any given scenario. Things improved gradually. Concept of state, boundries and armies stepped in with time. Departments and systems were introduced. Means of communication were very rare which were basic hurdle in preparation and implementation of the current systems. Progress of humanity has not been hated by Islam.

If every logical (Hikmat ke baat) point had to be outrightly included in Islamic world/states and code of life then there was no necessity of the Hadees (Naoozbillah) which states that the logical things are the lost property of Faithful people. "Hikmat ke baat Moman kee gumshuda meeras hai". This carries a clear meaning that other nations and people may have a logical viewpoint (except in religious matters) and if this appears to be logical in real sense, it should be adopted as if it was our developed viewpoint.

You must know that even in this so called democracy, implementation, enforcement and appreciation of law is very rare. Intervention of army, agencies and powerful circles is enormous. This is the situation where people have a right to speak. Then what would be the condition when this right will not exist. Media will not exist and basic rights would not exist.

In history still, if we dont hide realities and accept what has been gone in the history, (except for Hazrat Umar Raziallah's government), we cannot say that the muslims (I include all good and bad) made them the most successful governments specially becoz those who killed the three greatest men among all muslims (Khulfaa-e-Rashideen Raziallah) were also muslims or derivied by the muslims. Shahadat of Khulfaa (Raziallah Anhuma) is a Darja for them but for the then muslims, it was a big question on the success of the implementation of systems and government. There were certainly some differences and unresolved issues. I am not talking about the standard and level in nobality and Darja near ALLAH, there is no doubt over it, but politically speaking can these governments be called the best set-ups in the world. We muslims did not made such governments the best. Muslims were responsible for it. You must not forget wars of muslims with muslims in this whole era whereby thousands of noble men of Allah were killed by sword of other muslims. Should it be happened in a best set-up??????

SO this was the condition of the initial governments of muslims which in my view were also based upon an initial step towrads democracy.

And now where we as a nation have doubts on every one's character and such doubts are not totally untrue what could be expected and percieved. Do you feel our nation is so characterful that if someone is given absolute powers in real sense, he will use it like what Khulfaa-e-Rashideen (Raziallah) have done??????? (Big question with no solution except describing idealism that can never be acheived). Will any one would be courgeous enough as a Khalifa or Leader to hear the questions and allegations with all of patience and appreciation like what Hazrat Umar Raziallah heard form a Muslim Baddu about the cloth sheet/dress??????? (Big question with no solution except describing idealism that can never be acheived). How all muslims having different view points and school of thoughts can accept and gather under one flag??? Would it be feasible to select one sect/school of thought and eliminate all others specially where we are a nation who always describe each other as Kaafir and out of circle of Islam???? (No answer will come with sound logic). Would it be feasible to find out a Khalifa who will say that "it would be his sole responsibility even if a dog will die with starvation on the bank of river nile" like what Hazrat Umar Raziallah said?????????? (So many irrelavant answers could be expected).

So the list of questions will be ever continuing with no reasonable answer.

I understand that democracy has also failed in achieveing all targets in Pakistan more specifically becoz it has not been given a free hand to work its way in Pakistan. Army rulers have ever ruined democracy. Still, if one feels that his voice carrys some wightage and some social progress in the set up seems to be there, it is only by the reason of democratic set ups.

You just carry out a survey. In all underdeveloped areas of Pakistan (I am talking about grass root level where life of a poor and common man comes in question), development works remained in abeyance during whole of the era of General Zia-ul-Haq. We know Junejo was not carrying full democratic governance, still, each development work started when Zia brought that so-called democracy within the government and before that there was nothing except cricket. We need to study it. This will show u how democracy (however weak it is) works better than absolutely single handed governances. Exactly the same would happen if we find out a Khalifa from our own nation at the moment. If some one will say that ideally it should not happen, then I agree to him. But on this issue such idealism would only be a standard which we can never achieve.

However, notwithstanding my above submissions, I know this is a forum of delivering and sharing ideas. In my opinion democracy is the best solution at moment and is by no way against the teachings of Islam. I know at the same time so manys have and can have ideas contrary to my opinion. I have all my regards for others' opinion, which again is the part of democratic thought. Yes, we cannot become personal on such issues and should show patience while having detailed delibrations.

Sarfraz, I told you I am not a scholar to provide you Tafseer of Holy Quran. Further, even if I would be explaining you my view point, this may not match your school of thought. Therefore, you should read Tafaaseers of Ulemas available with us. I know by asking the explanation about Holy Verses, you are trying to say something. It would be better if you write down it as per your mindset. Your explanation may or may not agree to my view point. Still, it is not a matter of annoyance as there is no imposition in such matters.

Best regards,


Kamran.

[Astute Accountant]

Well, I was damn sure to be put IN THE LINE OF FIRE for making such a statement. But dear brothers what all I had said was based upon concrete facts. Neither have I any rivalry with the religious leaders nor I’m a big fan of the rest (particularly the ones that you people have mentioned). I respect all because we all are tied by the relationship of humanity (irrespective of religion, caste, creed, beliefs and one’s deeds) and also for the reason that they all are elders to me. And my religion teaches me to be respectful. So………

Yes, where I’ve disagreed to the MMA’s view are these issues
Firstly, when they were to contest for the first time their “intakhabi nishan” (sorry I’ve forgotten; what is it called in English. Hope everyone would overlook it ) ) was “book”. When convincing the general public, they said this is the Holy Book of Quran. If you people are not going to vote for us this would simply mean that you people are against Islam. So……… Later on, they denied that they had made any such statement.
Secondly, I agree that it’s Musharaf who has imposed emergency and not the MMA. But let me make it very much clear that MMA has played a major role in Musharaf’s becoming the president for the second time. Here is it answer
The leaders of MMA Qazi Hussain Ahmed had signed a petition in the Supreme Court to declare Musharaf ineligible for the candidature of president ship. But you know, what was the inside story??? It was just to make the “Supreme Court” declare for a second time that Musharaf is eligible for this seat and (this and that) articles support his candidature. In this way no one would find it a child’s play to challenge Musharaf’s eligibility, in future and in return for these they had taken a promise by the government that ‘some good seats’ would be reserved for them in future too.
These are just two of the examples.

Moreover, if I’ve made such a statement for MMA it doesn’t necessarily mean that I’m a supporter of Musharaf or PPP or PML. It was just an effort to call a spade a spade.

Hope the situation has been clarified now.